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 Marie Antoinette and Axel von Fersen 

Marie Antoinette and Axel von Fersen were lovers
Yes. 46%  46%  [ 36 ]
No. 38%  38%  [ 30 ]
I really don't know! 15%  15%  [ 12 ]
Total votes : 78

 Marie Antoinette and Axel von Fersen 
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Post Marie Antoinette and Axel von Fersen
Do you think that they were lovers? I don't know what should I vote!!


Mon Jun 26, 2006 2:49 pm
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I do not believe that they were lovers.

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:06 pm
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All of this is discussed elsewhere on the board, especially under the topic, "New TV movie." And under the topic "Josephine."

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:09 pm
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I firmly believe they were not lovers, friends yes of course!

I believe she was loyal to Louis XVI, she would never dare to become a lover. She disapproved against Madame Du Barry for being a mistress, so why would she go against her own word?

They were deeply friends in my opinion. Usually in friendships it could be physical, and Marie always had kissed, wept, embraced all her friends. Especially with her favorite, Polignac.

C.S Lewis actually stated that you will know if any friendship turns to love if they want privacy all the time and never include anyone involved in thier time. And he also said that friends share a common truth or interest. That is exactly what she had with fersen, common interest. She usually was seen with both Polignac and Fersen, and in the balls with him, rarely she was alone with him. She invivted all her friends to accompany her including Fersen. She even offered to Louis XVI to stop seeing him because of the rumors that they were lovers.

It was just a affectionate friendship, nothing more.


Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:09 pm
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She would not have risked committing treason (which is what adultery was for a queen) and having her children taken away from her if caught. Also, she went regularly to confession and if she had been having a long-term affair, the confessor would have ordered her to send her lover away, and Fersen was not sent away.

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:13 pm
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Exactly, Therese!

Marie was always confessing her sins, so of course, she would confess she had a lover.


Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:15 pm
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Also, she was very conscious of her honor as queen and would not have wanted to risk having a bastard as an heir to the throne of France.

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:20 pm
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Also, she was not that unhappy with Louis, and there is a lot about their relationship under the Louis XVI threads.

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Last edited by Therese on Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:21 pm
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Therese wrote:
Also, she was very conscious of her honor as queen and would not have wanted to risk having a bastard as an heir to the throne of France.


Yes, I think that Queens couldn't risk having a lovers! I'm not saying that she didn't felt attached to him, because his good locking and nobility, but she should, as a conscious Queen, remained faithful to her husband, King of France.

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:24 pm
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They did the same exact rumor with Queen Elizabeth I, she was a good Queen and still they attacked her saying she did have a lover.

Usually, the good Queens are always attacked, I never hear anything though about Henry VIII or Louis XV, I keep hearing normal things about them yet when it comes to great Queens or Kings, than we hear the negativity or the rumors.


Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:28 pm
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Furthermore, Fersen was busy enough with his own private life ! All these mistresses to satisfy... and his king who asked for so much ! For sure he did not need Marie-Antoinette on the top of this ! :lol:

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 4:31 pm
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Whit whom did Fersen married?

I know that he had a terrible death. He was spanked to death in Sweden! :(

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Mon Jun 26, 2006 5:38 pm
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Fersen never married. He proposed to a young lady, who refused, and, later, he once wrote to his sister that he did not want to marry for he thought "that marriage was anti-nature. He could not be to the person he wanted to be, so, he did not want to be to anybody". Many people thinks that he refered to Marie-Antoinette. But who knows, actually ? He had numerous mistresses, anyway. One of them wanted to marry him, sensual Eleonora (whom he called El in his diary), while, in the meantime, the queen (whom he called Elle in his diary) was dying in the conciergerie, from illness and sorrow.

Indeed, Fersen had a terrible death, really inhuman. On a June 20th, furthermore, the anniversary of this expedition stopped at Varennes he helped to organize. The poor man was slaughter by a furious mob in Sweden. http://axelvonfersen.free.fr/

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Last edited by Pimprenelle on Tue Oct 24, 2006 9:06 am, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Jun 26, 2006 5:54 pm
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Fersen actually considered Marie as his bride. He wrote a letter saying he loved no other but her, however, Marie was strictly devoted as a wife.


Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:52 am
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Which letter, please, Louis-Antoinette ? Can you quote it and give references ? I'd be very interested in knowing more about this letter... since letters mean so much to me ! :wink:

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Tue Jun 27, 2006 6:47 am
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