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United States' debt to Louis XVI and his advisors
http://forum.marie-antoinette.org/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=451
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Author:  Yolande [ Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:16 pm ]
Post subject:  United States' debt to Louis XVI and his advisors

How much was France's financial support of the American Revolution responsible for the fall of the monarchy?

Author:  Louis-Charles [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:32 am ]
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It is true that the war of America is the principal cause of the deficit , and thus is a great cause of the révolutiuon. :D
I do not remember any more of the cost... But I think that even without this war it would has been a revolution, may be later...

Author:  melly [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:43 pm ]
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[quote="Louis-Charles"]It is true that the war of America is the principal cause of the deficit , and thus is a great cause of the révolutiuon..../q]


Didn't France already have a huge debt becasue of it's involvement in the Seven Years’ War and Louis XVI also inherited all the debts from the last few kings ?

In other words wasn't France already in great financial trouble long before it undertook American War of Independence? Helping bankroll the War of Independence added to a mess already there , made it worse but did not cause it.

Author:  Therese [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:04 pm ]
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Yes, melly, that is true!

Author:  Louis-Charles [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:52 pm ]
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Indeed Melly when Louis XVI arrived at the throne the situation was not very advantageous it is sure...
But the war of America was really expensive...and it did not improve anything for the finances of the kingdom. This war did nothing exept worsen very quickly the things. :D

Author:  melly [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:20 pm ]
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Louis-Charles wrote:
Indeed Melly when Louis XVI arrived at the throne the situation was not very advantageous it is sure...
But the war of America was really expensive...and it did not improve anything for the finances of the kingdom. This war did nothing exept worsen very quickly the things. :D


Yes, I agree the helping to pay for this war made things much worse for France.

I am not writing well today. I am sorry.

I just think one has to look at a very, very big picture to see why there was a revolution in France, the deficits was already there, the people were already bad off, everyone was angry, the throne was undermined .....many many things. (Snow ball effect.)


How much was France's financial support of the American Revolution responsible for the fall of the monarchy?
Was the original question -

I just do not see the aid to the colonies as the reason the monarchy fell. If France had not helped finance the war BUT things kept up as they were in France I think the monarchy would have still fallen.

Author:  Louis-Charles [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:26 pm ]
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Melly wrote :

Quote:
I just do not see the aid to the colonies as the reason the monarchy fell. If France had not helped finance the war BUT things kept up as they were in France I think the monarchy would have still fallen.



I agree Melly :wink:
I will try to find the exact cost of this war, certain historians gave it. But indeed even without this war the revolution would have been done early or late... this war accelerated the things :wink:

Author:  Therese [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:46 pm ]
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The fact that Louis XVI supported the Americans in spite of finances showed that he was a man of vision. He knew geography better than most people, and he was surely aware of the vastness of the land that would become the United States, and the capacity for expansion and natural resources. He must have known that it would be advantageous for France in the long run to break up the British Empire, while bringing a young and growing country into alliance with France. He was correct in guessing that the alliance with the United States would prove very good for France in future times.

Author:  Arietta [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:54 pm ]
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France wasn't the only country looking to get square with England so it was a way to get even for lost North American possessions (ie Canada).

Author:  Therese [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:55 pm ]
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Arietta wrote:
France wasn't the only country looking to get square with England so it was a way to get even for lost North American possessions (ie Canada).


That is also true.

Author:  Louis-Charles [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:59 pm ]
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You are right Therese!
Louis XVI was I think a big tactician! If we do not look at the costs, the war of America had only advantages for France and American: economy, release of their people, the regression of England, and the good image of France in the world.
For that Louis XVI was right to do this war. But he neglected the costs, like his ministers. :?

Author:  Therese [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:03 pm ]
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I think he was hoping his tax reform (taxing the wealthy nobles) would pay for the war. There was no reason for a wealthy, prosperous nation like France, the first nation in Europe, to have any debt at all.

Author:  Arietta [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:04 pm ]
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At the time of the Revolution, a considerable portion of the money going towards the national debt.

Author:  melly [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:15 pm ]
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Therese wrote:
The fact that Louis XVI supported the Americans in spite of finances showed that he was a man of vision. He knew geography better than most people, and he was surely aware of the vastness of the land that would become the United States, and the capacity for expansion and natural resources. He must have known that it would be advantageous for France in the long run to break up the British Empire, while bringing a young and growing country into alliance with France. He was correct in guessing that the alliance with the United States would prove very good for France in future times.


This is very correct! Indeed that he was brilliant to see this (politically, financially) would be the best thing in the long run for France. It would have except he, being a man of honor counted on the New Americans to be more helpful to him and France than I think they turned out to be.

(I have to do some brushing up here). I think, after the war ended, the Americans went on to continued to be allies with Britain. Giving them deals that France was counting on and did not happen (I cannot think of the term)

Author:  melly [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:17 pm ]
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Louis-Charles wrote:
Melly wrote :



I will try to find the exact cost of this war, certain historians gave it.:[/quote]

This would be very interesting.
I would be interested.

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