Marie Antoinette Online Forum
http://forum.marie-antoinette.org/

One theory about their conjugal visits
http://forum.marie-antoinette.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1118
Page 2 of 3

Author:  Rosalie [ Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

I also know this; that's why I think that, whatever happened before, at that time the problem was essentially psichological.

Author:  Pimprenelle [ Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

Quote:
Apparently Louis XVI had told him how he had been having good erections and could get inside her but couldn’t ‘stay’ there and finish the work - or begin with it. Joseph wrote that in a letter to his brother while staying in their home. Joseph had advised him and whatever he had told him worked because their consummation afterwards was full; Joseph obviously had more experience in that field.

That is quite true. Joseph explains this in a letter to his brother, Grand Duc of Toscane. This letter Stephan Zweig did not read, that is why he made such a mistake about this operation thing.

Author:  Hellou_Librorum [ Tue Apr 22, 2008 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

So that explains where the whole "operation" theory came from! Merci Pimpernelle! :D

Author:  Comte de Provence [ Tue Apr 22, 2008 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

oh! i get it! :D
thank you so much pim!!!

Author:  Pimprenelle [ Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

You're welcome ! Please thank Simone Bertiere, she is the one who found this ! :wink:

Author:  Comte de Provence [ Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

oh i must!
*writes email*

Author:  Ludy [ Thu May 01, 2008 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

I think that indeed it must have been more psychological (although I don't deny physical causes that migh have worsened things, such as the "narrowness of passage"). They were far too young and bad experiences at the very beginning may have put them off consummating their marriage for a long time. What's more, I don't think their was a strong physical attraction between them.

Author:  Comte de Provence [ Thu May 01, 2008 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

i dont think anything fullly developed between the pair before MA took interest in Louis hobbies, then he became interested in her.

Author:  ShaktiValkyrie [ Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

Also keep in mind that from his birth he was told and schooled that Austria and it's people were bad and inferior. I think it would take a lot for him overcome those false beliefs.
I think it was Frasier that said even after her arrival his tutor was still teaching him that.

One thing I do wonder, and this might sound a bit silly, is seeing as they had their own bed chambers, how did they know when to meet each other at the Royal "Conjugal" bed?
I don't think they would discuss it like we might today. That leaves me with passing private notes to the other. I'm not sure though.

Author:  Therese [ Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

ShaktiValkyrie wrote:
One thing I do wonder, and this might sound a bit silly, is seeing as they had their own bed chambers, how did they know when to meet each other at the Royal "Conjugal" bed?


It was really up to Louis. He would usually send word that he was planning to "visit," although sometimes he would just show up.

Author:  ShaktiValkyrie [ Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

ok, thank you! :)

Author:  Christophe [ Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

My feeling on this subject is simple: they were both unschooled in sex, and at such tender age, really had no idea what they were doing. Joseph wrote that Louis' idea of intercourse consisted of entering his wife and remaining still for several minutes, then withdrawing---no action, no stimulation, no conclusion, and so... the Dauphine remained unfertilized.

Author:  ShaktiValkyrie [ Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

Christophe wrote:
My feeling on this subject is simple: they were both unschooled in sex, and at such tender age, really had no idea what they were doing. Joseph wrote that Louis' idea of intercourse consisted of entering his wife and remaining still for several minutes, then withdrawing---no action, no stimulation, no conclusion, and so... the Dauphine remained unfertilized.


Yes, I would agree. It's sad though, that's how one of my closets friends got pregnant. Basically he entered, she changed her mind and said no. He withdrew and that was that. He was real nice about it and they're still friends However, no condom was used and she ended up with a baby girl from that brief encounter. (turns out he's gay. He was trying not to be for along time, but when he heard she was pregnant, he came out. All are the better for it.)
I can't help but to think if just Marie Antoinette were that lucky...
Though, maybe it's a good thing that nothing did result from it. If it did work, they might have though that was the correct way and end up not conceiving again. Or for a very long time.

Author:  Saoirse [ Fri Nov 28, 2008 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

Don't you think it was awful that those two poor teenage strangers were actually expected to consummate their marriage immediately? I don't think it matters which era you're from, that's really unfair and sad. :(

Author:  Marija Vera [ Fri Nov 28, 2008 11:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: One theory about their conjugal visits

ShaktiValkyrie wrote:
Yes, I would agree. It's sad though, that's how one of my closets friends got pregnant. Basically he entered, she changed her mind and said no. He withdrew and that was that. He was real nice about it and they're still friends However, no condom was used and she ended up with a baby girl from that brief encounter. (turns out he's gay. He was trying not to be for along time, but when he heard she was pregnant, he came out. All are the better for it.)

:o

Page 2 of 3 All times are UTC
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/