my own feeling is that louis was simply overwhelmed by marie antoinette when she arrived at versailles...they were very young,he was shy,he had great loss in his life and then here comes this beautiful girl! could anyone blame him for NOT knowing what to do?

It is a terrible point for historians to know what happened during these fatal 7 years... ? Fatal, indeed... without humour, for during these 7 years, the king and queen's reputations were distroyed forever.

First of all, I think we have to put things back into context. Who was Antoinette ? Not at all this grown woman portrayed by Kirsten Dunst in Sofia Coppola's movie !

On the contrary, according to witnesses, Marie Antoinette was very small and tiny, being 14, she only looked 12. Her monthly cycle was not even fixed yet.

Who was Louis ? A shy teen, with a rather complicated and secretive psychology. But one thing we can be sure of is that this little girl, with no bosom at all, had nothing to awaken an adolescent's desires.

Considering events through this perspective, it is completely normal that Louis Auguste did not consummate his marriage that famous "nothing" first night.

Now, what happened later ? And why did it take 7 years, after all ? No one actually has the answer, of course... However, I consider it is not fair to put the blame on Louis. Both of them "did not know exactly what to do", and they may have been physically not appropriate to each other, causing terrible pains to both partners.

And I believe that Marie-Thérèse started to stress before the departure of her daughter for the France because Marie-Antoinette had never had her rules! Marie-Thérèse waited until the last minutes, and when her daughter had rules for the first time (in 1769 I believe), she accelerated the departure.
Thus when Marie-Antoinette came to France in 1770, she had just her first rules...

Indeed... and not yet really fixed ! For her "générale" (as she called it in her letter to her mother" stopped for several monthes.

And there is evidence that as early as 1773, 3 years into the marriage, they were both trying to consummate the union.

Yes indeed...Marie-Antoinette in her letters to her mother, regularly informed her about the evolution of their relations, and Marie-Thérèse gave her councils, such as for example practising many caresses etc...

This thread is pointless and is a film dicussion that we are not invloved with here

Well... thanks for expressing your opinion so nicely !

I thought it was an interesting discussion.

I think so, dear Therese !

Um me too. And isn't it the mods who decide whether something is pointless or not? *shrugs*

The thing is though, even if he just wasn't attracted to her because she was young and childish looking, wouldn't it have been likely that he would have had a mistress at some point? Artois apparently did by age 13. But Louis didn't seem interested in ANY women, even though many would have been available to him. Of course that could be down to chronic shyness.

Louis had been raised and very strict religious principles. He also had the model of his grand-father, Louis XV, and did not want to follow it.

True but it didn't appear to stop Artois. That said they were temperamentally very different I guess. I have not seen a situation anywhere that Louis ever had a mistress or a lover other than Antoinette at any point during his life.

Certain people proposed to Louis XVI to choose a mistress, but he always refused, because he wanted to be faithful to Marie-Antoinette. And contrary to Louis XV, he did not like really the sex

But Artois had several mistresses indeed!

I am not so sure that Artois had exactly the same education. He was not supposed to be king. Louis soon was, after having lost her brother and her father.

Furthermore, you must be right, there was a temperamental difference between those boys. I'd even say, between Artois and his brothers. Provence had no mistress either.

Artois on the other hand was very interested in women ! especially comedians !