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 *Maybe he was just besotted? 
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I read once that he did consummate his marriage and may have gotten his wife pregnant, but she had a miscarriage

I never read such an information, dear Therese. From all that I read, Provence's marriage remained uncosummated. Is your source reliable ? For it would be quite astonishing, wouldn't it ?

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:40 pm
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Morever Provence was really not attracted by his wife, who did not like hygiene… Provence had tried to persuade Versailles that he had consumed his marriage, but everyone knew that it was false… :D

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:48 pm
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Louis-Charles wrote:
Morever Provence was really not attracted by his wife, who did not like hygiene… Provence had tried to persuade Versailles that he had consumed his marriage, but everyone knew that it was false… :D


That could also be the case. And his wife did not really like men, either.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:56 pm
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Pimprenelle wrote:
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I read once that he did consummate his marriage and may have gotten his wife pregnant, but she had a miscarriage

I never read such an information, dear Therese. From all that I read, Provence's marriage remained unconsummated. Is your source reliable ? For it would be quite astonishing, wouldn't it ?


I read it in a bio of Marie-Josephine. I'll try to find the source. I read somewhere else an allusion to Marie-Josephine getting pregnant, but can't remember exactly where.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:02 pm
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I read that the French ambasador to Savoy prevailed upon her father to try and exercise his influence and get her to brush her teeth and practice other types of hygiene.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:07 pm
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Therese wrote :

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I read it in a bio of Marie-Josephine


It's very strange indeed....And the author says that the father would have been Provence? Because may be Marie-Josephine had a lover....even if it would be astonishing considering her possible attraction for the women :D

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:09 pm
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Yes, she certainly had those proclivities.

You all know so much more about these things than I do, certainly the book I read must be wrong.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:13 pm
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I don't know Therese....may be it will be interesting to read others books about Josephine....to compare....but I never read a biography about her :D
I know just the opinions of the historians speaking about Marie-Antoinette and Louis XVI :?

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:23 pm
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The books about Louis XVI and Marie-Antoinette all say the same things about the Provences. That is why it is interesting sometimes to read the other point of view.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:30 pm
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Exact Therese! :D
I also adore to read the contemporaries's memories ! In this moment I read Fraser, but after I will read the memories of Estherhazy :wink:

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:32 pm
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The books about Louis XVI and Marie-Antoinette all say the same things about the Provences. That is why it is interesting sometimes to read the other point of view.

I never read any book about Madame. In bios of Antoinette or Louis, they said Provence's marriage was not consummated. I never read anything about a miscarriage of Madame. :shock: That's why I am astonished. As far as I know, Provence's diabetes caused an impotence.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:53 pm
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I had never heard a hint that Maria Josepha was a lesbian - is that documented or just court gossip?

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:02 pm
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Several historians speak about it… I do not know how many, but they are several… the doubt exists :wink:
The coumtesse of Provence would have had relations with a woman of her service...

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:10 pm
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Several historians speak about it… I do not know how many, but they are several… the doubt exists

Well... She is supposed to have been in love with her reader, Mme de Gourbillon. A very sad story, in my view, for the lady encouraged Madame's penchant for drinking... that was certainly stronger than her penchant for women ! :lol:

They also said that Monsieur was gay... :wink:

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:18 pm
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Yes there are many doubtful things…too many may be....I do not know what to believe in all that… I am just sure that they were never in love … there it is clear :lol:

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:23 pm
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