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 Grotto 
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Post Grotto
EM Vidal has this post about the Grotto:
http://teaattrianon.blogspot.com/2009/06/grotto-at-trianon.html
Has anyone else visited? I didn't make it over there when I was at Petit Trianon 5 years ago.


Thu Jun 18, 2009 4:01 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Thanks for posting this, Arietta. I did visit it before they cleaned it so I appreciate the photos which recapture some of the past splendor!

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Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:07 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Not the best picture, taken in 2007.


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Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:22 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Thanks, Lilly! That's how it looked when I was there!

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Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:25 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Here is another picture - this was very near the grotto. Did you happen to see this tree, Therese? You are able to walk through and come out on the other side - cozy little area inside - what do you suppose the purpose of this was? Possibly a tryst in a tree???


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Thu Jun 18, 2009 6:57 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Thanks, Lilly! They are very good pictures. I like this sight of the Grotto!

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Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:15 am
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Post Re: Grotto
:shock: 8)

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Last edited by Therese on Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:29 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
A tryst does not necessarily mean sex.


Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:02 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Oh - Anouk, Thank You to you because I wouldn't have known how to post a picture without your help!!!


Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:27 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
:roll:

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Last edited by Therese on Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:12 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Like so many people have already realized, at the time of Rococo there were two kind of love.

1. erotic allusions (sex has always been a perpetual thing, every epoch developed its sexual traditions)
2. platonic, sentiment-shot love. You may know how valorized was emotional affection at that time. Therese, think of, how much a prince could love a "simple" comtesse or baronesse, maybe the daughter of a burgess... Courtesans, peasant girls were able to become a lover of a lord. I am sure you also know how valued was two women's friendship. They needed pectoral affection. People needed a place where they musn't hide their emotions from the rules of the etiquette. I am pretty sure about this was the main reason whereat a "tryst" could built.

I am just writing this to prove that a "tryst" is not definitely about sex :shock: I must agree with Lilly.

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Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:23 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
:o

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Last edited by Therese on Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:34 pm
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Post Re: Grotto
Can we please maintain a high level of respect for each other here?


Sat Jun 20, 2009 1:16 am
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Post Re: Grotto
:biggrin:

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Last edited by Therese on Thu Jun 25, 2009 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Jun 20, 2009 1:23 am
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Post Re: Grotto
Oh My! Let's back up a little here - the original post............and response
Therese wrote:
Lilly wrote:
Here is another picture - this was very near the grotto. Did you happen to see this tree, Therese? You are able to walk through and come out on the other side - cozy little area inside - what do you suppose the purpose of this was? Possibly a tryst in a tree???


A tryst? With a lover? I think not. She went there to be alone. And she often brought her children there. It was a magical place for them. Everything does not have to be about sex.


Since you said that you'd been there, I asked if you had seen and knew the purpose of the tree. The tryst remark was supposed to have been lighthearted but apparently was not taken as so. I said a tryst (which of course we know can mean different things) - You said lovers, you said "Everything does not have to be about sex" Where did I mention sex? I felt chastised by your reply. I never disrespected the Queen or any body else or even mentioned the Queen in my post. I am also missing the part where you asked me to clarify myself? My response and yours to the above post....
Therese wrote:
Lilly wrote:
A tryst does not necessarily mean sex.


That's good to know...... 8)



Anouk contributed useful information in response to the tryst - in which she was curtly dismissed:
Therese wrote:
Anouk wrote:
Like so many people have already realized, at the time of the Rococo there were two kind of love.

1. erotic allusions (sex has always been a perpetual thing, every epoch developed its sexual traditions)
2. platonic, sentiment-shot love. You may know how valorized was emotional affection at that time. Therese, think of, how much a prince could love a "simple" comtesse or baronesse, maybe the daughter of a burgess... Courtesans, peasant girls were able to become a lover of a lord. I am sure you also know how valued was two women's friendship. They needed pectoral affection. People needed a place where they musn't hide their emotions from the rules of the etiquette. I am pretty sure about this was the main reason whereat a "tryst" could built.

I am just writing this to prove that a "tryst" is not definitely about sex :shock: I must agree with Lilly.


Thank you for the history lesson, Anouk. Yes, I actually have read about these things before. I do know a little about the eighteenth century, believe it or not. I am aware that there were innocent trysts. I was just not certain of the kind of tryst to which Lilly was referring. But she has explained what she meant.


It was this and your earlier response to me which I felt that a level of respect was degenerating.

Therese wrote:
Lilly wrote:
Can we please maintain a high level of respect for each other here?


Yes, indeed. And respect for the Queen. Lily, we were speaking of her little grotto and you were the one who had to bring up the subject of trysts, of which there are more than one kind. The fact that I asked you to clarify yourself is considered disrespectful?



Where did you see any disrespect for the Queen, whom I never mentioned? I'm sure you know that MA was not the only one to ever own or live at the Petite Trianon. And what if I bought up the subject of trysts? Is there a rule here against that? Where did I err Therese? Again, you never asked me to clarify myself, so I'm sure thats not what I considered disrespectful. I think that something has been misunderstood here.


Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:35 am
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