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 Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette 
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Noble
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I must say, it is a lovely movie. Not scriptwise, god no, that... sucks. But the set, and the clothes. And I really felt her agony, I think that is what the movie is about, that above all the glamour and cakes and such there was a scared lonely girl.
It doesn't matter if you are a archduchess or not. A 14-yearold girl will be suffering from the changes around her, she is finding out who she are. For example the princesses today have also been ”groomed” to fit a role, such as the swedish crownprincess. She had a pretty wilde youth, had anorexia, and today she is a perfect princess. (and is now being pressured to produce a child)
And I think that this is one of a few movies that put Louis XVI in a better light, alas he isn't a bloody retard or a old stubborn idiot.

And yes, I watch this movie, you know what: I like to think that this is how Marie was. (especially the interaction between her and Marie-Therese at Trianon and the Hameau, I loved thoose sences) But it's very rare that I ever get trough the wedding now a days.

Then again, I am only 16, I was 12 when I saw it for the first time, and I was so pissed that it didn't have the revolution. I was sitting and waiting for it, enjoying the scenes, waiting for the action to begin! And it never did...

Overall, I love it, but only for the set, clothes and food, (and the filming) but I hate the inaccuries.


Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:58 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I'm not particularly a fan. I think the movie is neither good as it own and it's not a very flattering or interesting portray of Marie Antoinette.
The movie portrays her as this weird teenager who never grows and spend her whole life eating her feelings, spending money and gambling. It doesn't show the cruelty of other to her. How she was constantly blamed for everything. How she was kept from the whole politicals of the country.
It fails to go deeper into her, to actually shows why she's an icon. Why people adore her. And most of all, it doesn't show her during the French Revolution, which is the most important part of her life.
Anyone who doesnt know a thing about MA will finish the movie not really getting why she's important, why she deserves to be remembered because all they see is a girl who lives like Paris Hilton with less freedom.


Sun Jul 31, 2011 1:59 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
Its' true that you cannot understand Marie Antoinette without taking into account the French revolution period, wherein she revealed her true mature self. Its' like reading half a book or playing just one half in a football game.

I'd like to think that Coppola was subtle enough to have tried to portray some allegorical figure loosely inspired by Marie Antoinette, a kind of youth icon transposable into modern society. However I cannot, and I really do think that Coppola thought she was portraying the real Marie Antoinette up to 1789...and she was so very far from succeeding. The film has some nice moments and is very prettily filmed...but it shows up a director so far removed from an understanding of 18th century France, despite its' attempts to keep close to historical truth.

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Mon Aug 01, 2011 9:03 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
baron de batz wrote:
Its' true that you cannot understand Marie Antoinette without taking into account the French revolution period, wherein she revealed her true mature self. Its' like reading half a book or playing just one half in a football game.

I'd like to think that Coppola was subtle enough to have tried to portray some allegorical figure loosely inspired by Marie Antoinette, a kind of youth icon transposable into modern society. However I cannot, and I really do think that Coppola thought she was portraying the real Marie Antoinette up to 1789...and she was so very far from succeeding. The film has some nice moments and is very prettily filmed...but it shows up a director so far removed from an understanding of 18th century France, despite its' attempts to keep close to historical truth.


It reminds me that Alain Delon declined to play Louis XV in Coppola's film by telling her that to his mind, it was a bad idea for an American to make a film about French history. I would not agree on this statement as a general thing, but it turned out that, this time, he was correct.

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Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:20 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I agree. Although I don't see a problem with having a foreigner make a film of it (it could've had a good outside perspective), I think my main gripe was it was riddled with inaccuracies. It was an ok example of what it was, and would've got people interested in Marie Antoinette, but the Fersen thing and the drunk champagne and cake scenes made me fume. :roll:

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Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:45 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
Délicate fleur wrote:
I agree. Although I don't see a problem with having a foreigner make a film of it (it could've had a good outside perspective), I think my main gripe was it was riddled with inaccuracies. It was an ok example of what it was, and would've got people interested in Marie Antoinette, but the Fersen thing and the drunk champagne and cake scenes made me fume. :roll:



As it happens, sometimes foreigners make better film than natives. See Dangerous Liaisons for instace, the French version, although I personnally like it, is not half as good as the American one. Besides, there is sometime a real lack of money is the French cinema. But when a foreigner makes a film whose plot has to do with the history or literature of some foreign country, I feel he/she should make sure that he/she has more than a superficial knowledge of things.

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Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:25 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I though Steven Frears (the director) was English? Nevermind, I see what you are trying to say.

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Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:51 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I agree with Pennilayn. I really enjoyed the movie for what it is, and did not expect to see a documentary.

Sofia Coppola I think she is attracted to women who are isolated (Virgin Suicides, Lost in Translation, Marie Antoinette) and to me her movies are not plot-driven, won't have lots of dialogue pushing the story along, with climaxes in the plots here and there... they all seem to me very mood-driven, it's all about creating the atmosphere and making you feel that isolation as well, dialogue is less in her movies I feel. It's a very specific style I guess, and I think (most of) my male friends would not like her movies.

Then after I read Antonia Fraser's biography (I don't know if it's accurate but assume it is OK), I think the movie's "overall" viewpoint of Marie Antoinette quite matches Antonia Fraser's one - young girl, thrust into something big, didn't quite grow up, not meant to be educated and was there to make children and she did party quite a bit...

At the end, although Antonia Fraser's account of Marie Antoinette's life in the prisons and how she defended herself in court was very very sad and it was a great story, think it was ok Sofia Coppola didn't include these tragic last bits. Her endings usually seems neither here nor there and leaves one wanting more. Maybe its her style :) If she had included a proper ending, I would have left the show crying!

In Lost in Translation (sorry to digress from Marie Antoinette), I remember her ending was also unconventional to me, a little "huh?", it wasn't happy nor sad, it just "is" (sorry, hard to explain), but now that she's done it, I quite like it =p


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Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:05 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I saw Sofia Coppola's last film. It was quite useless, and I've never been so bored. Some story about an actor father and daughter. I realized then firstly how immensely difficult it must be for an American, without a very strong knowledge of European history, to make a decent film about Marie Antoinette, and secondly that she was probably quite simply far too limited to make a good film about her. She probably skipped onto this project and skipped off it again, like a girl with a new dress that she will soon tire of. The actors were as superficial as the film, and the French revolution and Marie Antoinette were never superficial themes, even at the height of the latter's frivolry. When you compare it with the deep, serious fierce reality of 'L'autrichienne' with Ute Lemper, it makes me smile wearily. I think if I had Coppola opposite me and questioned her on MA, I would be writhing in despair. I would have preferred her to call it "Girlies in pretty dresses, let's rock!" or something like that.

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Mon Feb 20, 2012 10:20 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I totally agree young Baron. I loved the costumes of course, but I didn't like the modern music which didn't fit in at all and the actors should have learned to speak with a French accent. The Lempur film which I downloaded in English from youtube was far superior. I remember years ago Mary Queen of Scots was broadcast with Katherine Hepburn as the Queen and my dad laughed his head off at the Queen speaking with a very American accent. It was historically dismal. I find the French and British are the best at making historical dramas.


Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:04 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
The best being the English I find.

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Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:29 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
Generally speaking the standard of the BBC, ITV and Channel 4 historical dramas is quite amazingly high. I have many of them.

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Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:31 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
Maggie wrote:
I totally agree young Baron. I loved the costumes of course, but I didn't like the modern music which didn't fit in at all and the actors should have learned to speak with a French accent. The Lempur film which I downloaded in English from youtube was far superior. I remember years ago Mary Queen of Scots was broadcast with Katherine Hepburn as the Queen and my dad laughed his head off at the Queen speaking with a very American accent. It was historically dismal. I find the French and British are the best at making historical dramas.


I beg to disagree, I loved the film on the Revolution with Jane Seymour, but was that an American production ? I would not say that American historical drama are that bad, as a general thing. For one thing, they have usually more funds, and the costumes look way better than in the French equivalents.

As for historical drama, well, I personnally like the old ones, for instance 1972 version of the Accursed Kings, which was breathtaking, in spite of the fact that the production was clearly cash-strapped -the actors made it up. There was a post about the King's way, which is also outstanding, both with regards to the accuracy and the costumes.

I think with regards to the French cinema, it is often all or nothing. Either the film is excellent, or it is disastrous. Ok I may be stretching the truth. But there is a certain style you have to adjust to. For instance, our directors are a little too on the intellectual side, or like to believe they are on the intellectual side and resort to conceptual mise-en-scènes. The French also love hysterical historical films, such as La Reine Margot, or Marquise, with plenty of sex, shrieking, whispering and scurrying around -and either Sophie Marceau or Isabelle Adjani. But once you took to them, it's just fine ! :lol:

the best historical films I ever seen starred Isabelle Adjani by the way. I worship her, completely. And I do like The Queen Margot, but it does take some time to get used to it.

By the way, Isabelle Adjani did play Mary Queen of Scots. It must have been something. But it was in theater and I was not lucky enough to attend it.


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Mon Feb 20, 2012 3:21 pm
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
I love the movie personally - not as an accurate portrayal of Marie (anyone expecting that would be bitterly disappointed), but as a beautifully stylized film that's a joy to watch. I notice new details each time. I just try not to take it too seriously and enjoy it for the dazzling entertainment that it is. If I were to focus too hard on the inaccuracies, I fear my head would spin. :wink:


Thu Mar 22, 2012 2:20 am
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Post Re: Coppola´s Marie-Antoinette
Woodland Nymph wrote:
I love the movie personally - not as an accurate portrayal of Marie (anyone expecting that would be bitterly disappointed), but as a beautifully stylized film that's a joy to watch. I notice new details each time. I just try not to take it too seriously and enjoy it for the dazzling entertainment that it is. If I were to focus too hard on the inaccuracies, I fear my head would spin. :wink:


Honestly, quite apart from the inaccuracies, I think the movie was quite tedious.

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Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:08 am
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